Interacting like a normal person

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:03 am

Okay, I make no effort to hide the fact that I have a social-development disability (Ass Burgers), though I'd rather not use it as a blanket excuse for anything I do. But given that, to an extent, it is a disability that can be overcome, that sounds like something I could get help with.

There is someone I wish to meet in a normal friendly manner, the way normal people do. Now I do have a bit of a crush on her, and she knows it and doesn't really mind this fact, but that's not why I wish to get to know her better: I actually do want to make new friends here, and try socialising on my own just a little bit, rather than the usual "Get introduced by mutual friend" thing.

How do normal people do this? I thought maybe asking if she'd like to go get a cup of coffee/tea somewhere could work, but isn't that what people do specifically as part of a courting process of Coffee -> Dinner -> Fuck each other's brains out? Do people just ask to go out for a drink as a regular "I'd like to chat in a casual environment and become friends" thing?

And basically, what's the proper way to word things so that I don't sound like the awkward freak that I am? I'd really hate to over-analyse things as I go, trying to justify every single thing I say.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:16 am

Admittedly I'm the last person to be talking about normal ways of making friends or coupling, but as far as I know:

Coupling: Ask to go someplace where you can't do anything but talk to each other or be bored, because you are in a goddam hurry to get to know that person.

Friends: Invite to a social activity where you probably won't be talking all that much, just be hanging out doing the same thing at the same time.

Exception for movie of course, which swings the other way for I have no idea why.

If you really want to be friends, find common activities you can both do at the same time together, preferably even in larger groups.

Sports, games, that sort of thing. Invite her to a game of Settlers, it's fun, it's social interaction and getting to know the person, it involves mandatory other people, so it's obviously not a date, and it's the perfect length of time, with no possible future commitment.

You may want to scale back based on nerd cred.

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:17 am

It doesn't necessarily have to be over coffee/tea. However, it's usually a good icebreaker to form friendships for the following reasons:

* You usually have a coffee break in "neutral" territory. Like say a local Starbucks or something.
* Having drinks helps both parties relax and be at ease.

What's the specific context though? Is she a neighbor? A classmate? How well do you already know each other?

Depending on the context, asking someone to have a cup of coffee with you may or may not be the best way to get to know each other in a "normal" way.

For instance, if I want to be friends with a new officemate I usually have lunch with them, or hang out with them while they smoke.

Surgo · Post by **Surgo** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:18 am

Do you have common interests that you plan on chatting out? I've met virtually every one of my friends through one or both of the two following methods:

1) Video games; specifically fighting games.
2) The roleplaying club meetings.

So I tend to try to meet people by doing fighting games, and inviting people to come play fighting games with me. Maybe something similar could work for you with one of your interests.

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:29 am

Well, I met her through a softcore cosplay porn website, she's one of the models there. And we've chatted a bit on her webcam site, so basically, we don't know each other that well, but I'd like to know her a bit better, but the fact that I have saved a collection of pictures of her dressing/undressing as Seras Victoria from Hellsing might be a bit of a barrier.

Except on her website she basically has a Q&A thing of seriously every question anyone has ever asked her via Twitter/Facebook/Magic Telepathy, which includes "If someone asked you out for oral sex would you consider it?" "Maybe, depending on the person".

So she seems pretty friendly and approachable, so I'm thinking a random social thing (and part of the idea for coffee was "It's in a neutral, public place where she needn't be afraid that I'm actually a kodiak bear*") just to be friends might not be out of the question. No, I don't do this for every porn model I get a crush on (ignoring that this is the first instance I know of where said person is in the same state as me).

As for geek things, she likes anime (see cosplay, above), sci-fi and fantasy (was asking if I was going to a sci-fi con that was apparently this last weekend, from the sound of it there was an offer to catch up... and I ran out of credit before getting the location or anything. Not that I had the spare cash at the time), and roleplaying. Particularly old Vampire, and yes I do remember what Frank said about everyone he's had sex with he's played Vampire with. But "is a roleplayer" means "I'm not too far out of my comfort zone here, we have enough common hobbies to chat about".

Thanks for the advice though.

*It's more likely than you think. Almost a hundred people per year are killed by kodiak bears pretending to be people on the Internet.

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:38 am

Ergh... that's a bit more complicated than I thought this would be

.

Do you have a lot of chances to meet each other face to face regularly? I'm getting the sense you don't.

If that's the case, offer to be penpals to start it out. I've had a couple of penpals who are people I've never met except over the Internet.

K · Post by K » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:48 am

[edit]

Ok, I had some reasonable advice, but after reading the follow-up post I have to tell you: no.

People on softcore web-cams are humoring you. The chances of them ever becoming real friends (or more) is soul-crushingly low. There is a small chance they might be willing to let you pay for sex.

Sorry. You are in a situation that is past normal and comfortably in Crazytown.

Sarandosil · Post by **Sarandosil** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:58 am

I thought I was the only autistic lesbianz on teh internets.

Anyway she's undoubtedly got a zillion drooling fans already sending her creepy messages, so chances are you're going to get lost in the pile even if you do get over the low bar of seeming sane in comparison. Your chances are probably rather tiny.

I guess that's not advice, but don't be too crushed if you don't get a response. Otherwise K sounds like he knows what he's talking about.

Edit: ok K edited his post and removed the good stuff. But I'd say go for it anyway.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:58 am

I have to agree with K. Having read that... Not so much chance at all of anything.

ubernoob · Post by **ubernoob** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:58 am

Koumei · Post by **Koumei** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:06 am

ubernoob wrote: All of that comes down to "Talk to strangers."

I can't do that without a Blood-Alcohol level of "comatose, you just don't happen to know this yet". I mean, last time I went to a job interview, I needed so much codeine to calm my nerves that I ended up as pale as a ghost, sweating all crazy and then being sick afterwards.

Oh well, I'll make do with the friends I have, and eventually earnsteal enough cash to go to Sweden.

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:08 am

*sigh* You cynical people you... You people just HAD to put it in the most blunt way possible, don't you?

While I also have my suspicions given the girl's line of work, I'd still say give it a shot Koumei.

Just to share an experience:

I used to write fanfiction. Gundam fanfiction.

One day, while idly googling, I found a website with a really good Gundam fic. A bit of a lemon, but very good nonetheless.

So I contacted the author, and told her that I was impressed with her work. Now, she had lots of fan mail too, so I kinda doubted I'd ever get a reply.

But I did.

That got us e-mailing each other back and forth talking about Gundam, our personal lives, etc. We became fairly good friends.

In your case Koumei, try to think of some topic of discussion that could get an online conversation going between the two of you. Start it off on a postive note about her (i.e. "I like how friendly you seem") and give her a chance to talk about herself and interests (i.e. "So how did you become interested in anime?").

That sort of thing. Because even people who may seem as though they're drowning in attention also want to have normal friends too.

Good luck.

(P.S. That being said, now that the cat's out of the bag... don't be too disappointed if she doesn't respond at all. Because there is a fairly big chance that K's scenario does turn out to be true)

TOZ · Post by **TOZ** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:45 am

I met my wife on Gaia Online.

Yeah. What the fuck, right?

Sarandosil · Post by **Sarandosil** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:49 am

That's awesome, heh.

cthulhu · Post by **cthulhu** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:53 am

On the online topic: my mum and dad both play world of warcraft. Together.

So one day mum rings me up and says "Cthulhu, there is something I need to talk to you about, can we get breakfast?" I'm like, what the fuck? Anyway, go to breakfast that day.

When we sit down we make small talk for about 5 minutes, then mum says "There's something important I need to tell you" in her very best serious voice.

I'm thinking Does she have cancer? Are they getting divorced? What the hell?

Mum then says "So your Father isn't a very good tank"

She did not understand at all that I was seriously pissed off with this entire turn of events, nor was she trying to pull a prank me on me. It was the most surreal morning I've ever had.

Lago PARANOIA · Post by **Lago PARANOIA** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:00 am

Sarandosil wrote:Otherwise K sounds like he knows what he's talking about.

Of course he does.

Feeling LONELY, K?

Sarandosil · Post by **Sarandosil** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:06 am

Er? What are we implying here?

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:24 am

I don't know that it's hopeless, Koumei, just not normal.

I'd probably try keeping my eyes open for another convention or something similar - where she would probably also happen to be going - and try to arrange a meeting there. And not necessarily a sit-down, we're-gonna-chat-just-the-two-of-us kind of thing, either. A place where she can meet you without obligation, where there's other stuff to do, and where you and she can both see if getting to know each other is something you're both interested in.

Once you meet like two "normal" people off the street, then you'll be able to tell if she's interested in you as something more than a fan. If she remembers you and chats you and still seems interested, then try asking her out for coffee.

Cthulhu wrote:Mum then says "So your Father isn't a very good tank"

Sounds like she was having problems telling your dad that.

cthulhu · Post by **cthulhu** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:29 am

Maj wrote:
Cthulhu wrote:Mum then says "So your Father isn't a very good tank"
Sounds like she was having problems telling your dad that.

Yeah I know, the problem is that's sixty something so his reflexes are not that snappy, but jesus did that conversation really need a 9am sunday phonecall and the serious voice?

Wargh.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 4:44 am

cthulhu wrote:Yeah I know, the problem is that's sixty something so his reflexes are not that snappy, but jesus did that conversation really need a 9am sunday phonecall and the serious voice?

Wargh.

Apparently you missed the subtext. He's a really really bad Tank. So bad, she's divorcing him over it.

HAHAHAHA!

Ganbare Gincun · Post by **Ganbare Gincun** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 6:09 am

K wrote:[edit]

Ok, I had some reasonable advice, but after reading the follow-up post I have to tell you: no.

People on softcore web-cams are humoring you. The chances of them ever becoming real friends (or more) is soul-crushingly low. There is a small chance they might be willing to let you pay for sex.

Sorry. You are in a situation that is past normal and comfortably in Crazytown.

I am in concurrence with K. She's an attention whore, and she's not worth the trouble. Unlike K, I suspect that you *might* be able to have sex with her without paying for it, but you're probably looking at a week's worth of fun at best before she drops you like a hot coal. You may have to do some degrading things to achieve even that goal. And if you give her your heart, there's a good chance that she'll just flay it to a bloody pulp. Not what you wanted to hear, I know. But I've been in a similar neighborhood in Crazytown, and that's how that shit ends up panning out.

You need to find an attractive, nerdy girl that doesn't dress like a half-naked anime porn star in public, but is more then willing to do so for you in private. But the cosplayers, the Suicide Girls, the models... stay away from those types. They aren't worth the trouble.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 6:20 am

ubernoob wrote:-Met because someone made a D&D reference and we all decided we needed to make a D&D group.
...
All of that comes down to "Talk to strangers."

Last night at the goth night of the club, I went from talking about D&D with a friend and his friend, started just shouting "fuck you!" loudly and repetitively at the FoaF (he mentioned monk+VoP), to getting (possibly jokingly) chewed out by a random bystander about shouting fuck in a public venue (where half the songs use the word...

) to pulling said stranger into the gaming discussion, because I went to try and defend my shouting by first having to ask if he played D&D (he was a dirty 18-00 fighter/magic user 2nd ed player).

my friend and I traded patronizing glances when the stranger brought up WoD larping.

So I guess my advice, Koumei, is don't try normal interaction, go to a club on goth night, you will have eye candy far as the eye can see, cleavage that shows as much skin as if an entire boob was hanging out, and people who don't know the meaning of "normal interaction"

You can also get blitzed on liquid courage if need be and few people with glance twice.

My actual advice is "go for it, give it a shot, everything's worth at least one" if it goes somewhere, awesome, good for you (damned lucky bitch.. *grumble grumble*) if not, ah well, try again with the next cute nerd chick.

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:13 am

It's not as hopeless as all that. I have personally seen the last woman K slept with dressed as a Bondage Fairy, and it wasn't Halloween. Also, there are pictures of her doing that on the internet. However, the point at which sexy ladies start actually start participating in softcore porn chat rather than just running around Pfil in public places, they are probably into the shock and tease to the extent that they are not really interested in having real relationships.

That being said, if you wanted to be an actual friend, I would suggest that you suggest getting together for something that is not sexy times but still something she apparently likes to do: like a marathon of anime watching or something. Pick some show that is in new fansubs right now that neither one of you have seen (and is getting pretty decent reviews), and suggest watching it.

-Username17

CatharzGodfoot · Post by **CatharzGodfoot** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 7:52 am

Koumei, one way people who hate social interaction make friends is joining clubs. You know, animu clubs, gamer clubs, writers' clubs, etc. Going to a gathering of mutually assured interest is a way for people who have difficulty talking with others to talk with others without too much awkwardness.

That said, if you don't make an effort to interact with new people on a daily (or at least weakly basis), your social anxiety will get worse. If you do, it will get better, although at first it might be incredibly difficult for you. I consider myself fairly normal in terms of Cha-based skills (no autism, etc), but a few months of isolation after moving to NC and not having a job or school to meet new people made meeting new people (who weren't people my wife brought home from school) really tough. I ended up joining an aikido group, and now I'm feeling a lot more sane.

jadagul · Post by **jadagul** » Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:48 am

CatharzGodfoot wrote:Koumei, one way people who hate social interaction make friends is joining clubs. You know, animu clubs, gamer clubs, writers' clubs, etc. Going to a gathering of mutually assured interest is a way for people who have difficulty talking with others to talk with others without too much awkwardness.

That said, if you don't make an effort to interact with new people on a daily (or at least weakly basis), your social anxiety will get worse. If you do, it will get better, although at first it might be incredibly difficult for you. I consider myself fairly normal in terms of Cha-based skills (no autism, etc), but a few months of isolation after moving to NC and not having a job or school to meet new people made meeting new people (who weren't people my wife brought home from school) really tough. I ended up joining an aikido group, and now I'm feeling a lot more sane.

As an irregular mainly-lurker (and one who sympathizes with Koumei's problems), I really wanted to jump in and second this. I used to have really miserable social anxiety problems. They're under control now because I forced myself to go out and hang out with people a lot, and joined an activity (ballroom dancing) that forces you to interact with a whole bunch of people on a regular basis.

I'll also point out--and this is again from personal experience--social skills are in fact actual skills you can practice. I know it sounds goofy, but "How to Win Friends and Influence People" is a really good if somewhat dated book. Or even better--find a friend with good social skills, and have her (it's usually a her, because girls on average seem to be better at this) start pointing things out to you, telling you what she reads in social situations and why she makes the choices she does. (When I started dating seriously I honest-to-god ran every substantive conversation past two or three close friends with reasonably good judgment, and had one of them proof my emails before I sent them).

Bonus points if you can find a friend who's learned his (this one is more likely to be a he, but again not always) social skills explicitly and so can explain exactly why he evaluates situations the way he does; one of the best things for my anxiety was developing an explicit three- or four-item checklist of "behaviors people exhibit when you're annoying them" so that I could feel more comfortable assuming people who weren't doing that were happy to keep talking. (If you care, my favorite is that people subconsciously orient their bodies toward people they're comfortable with and away from people they're uncomfortable with; almost no one knows they're doing it, and even if you know you're doing it it's really bloody hard to control. If the person you're talking to has his/her torso pointed to within 45 degrees of you, you're probably good; when he/she has a shoulder aimed at you and is talking to you over it, it's time to leave).